
Nancy Wilson tells us about discovering Led Zeppelin—from walking out on their opening set for 5th Dimension to eventually hearing them at the right place at the right time.
Before they hit it big, Heart found themselves ripping club gigs, where they earned the nickname “Little Led Zeppelin.” It’s a moniker that stuck as the band carried the torch first lit by their heroes for decades to come. If you’ve ever seen the Kennedy Center video of Heart covering “Stairway to Heaven” for Robert Plant and Jimmy Page, you know how bright that fire burns.
After covering Nancy Wilson on an earlier episode of 100 Guitarists, we knew we had to invite her to join us on our Jimmy Page episode! She tells us about discovering Led Zeppelin—from walking out on their opening set for 5th Dimension to eventually hearing them at the right place at the right time—and shares her favorite songs, what it was like meeting Jimmy for the first time, and then what it was like to play for him at the Kennedy Center.
On our current listening segment, we’re talking about releases from guitarists Niwel Tsumbu and drummer Nate Smith.
This episode is sponsored by Gibson.
Nile Rodgers brings the rhythm at Bonnaroo 2018.
How the rhythm-playing hitmaker behind Chic—and our columnist—learned to love pop music, and why maybe you should, too.
When Nile Rodgers speaks, we should listen. His seminal work with his own band, Chic, as well as Sister Sledge, Michael Jackson, Mick Jagger, Eric Clapton, Peter Gabriel, Madonna, David Bowie, and Daft Punk, has made him a legend. He also filmed an entertaining Rig Rundown with PG just last year.
I recently listened to his 2017 South by Southwest address, where he told a story about a formative moment in his life. Nile was complaining to his guitar teacher, Ted Dunbar, about having to sing the Archies’ “Sugar, Sugar”at an upcoming cover band gig. Dunbar replied, “Let me tell you something. Any song that sells and gets to the Top 40 ... is a great composition.” Rodgers was skeptical. Then Dunbar added, “Especially ‘Sugar, Sugar.’ That has been No. 1 for four or five weeks.” Next, Dunbar said something that changed Rodger’s life. “‘Sugar, Sugar’ was successful,” he said, “because it speaks to the souls of a million strangers.” Rodgers noted: “Two weeks later, I wrote a song called ‘Everybody Dance.’” Released in 1977, it was a Top 40 single on Chic's first album.
In a BBC This Cultural Life interview, Rodgers said that Dunbar “described an artist to me. I wasn’t an artist until he defined that. I wanted to speak to the souls of a million strangers, but I thought what I wanted to do was speak to some real cool people hanging out in jazz clubs.”
“Everybody Dance” and “Sugar, Sugar”both have hypnotizingly simple lyrics you inevitably replay in your head. Humans like chants, cheers, slogans, and catchy choruses. Rodgers' success came, at least in part, from opening himself up to simplicity that appeals to the masses instead of the complexity that appeals to jazzers. That’s the irony. Jazz, which ostensibly is all about freedom, is often restrictive. Like the old joke goes, jazzers play millions of chords for four people. Pop, rock, and country artists play four chords for millions of people.
Rodgers said, “That's what my teacher taught me, that anti-snobbery. Be open. Love all the music you are around, or at least try and appreciate what that artist is trying to say. Try and have, what we call in the music business, big ears.”
My friends and I have all, at times, been music snobs. I went through a blues binge in my youth where I was prejudiced against shredders. This was not uncommon at the time. After Nirvana hit with Nevermind in 1991, suddenly musicians were openly mocked for playing complex, difficult parts. It was almost like if you cared enough to really learn to play guitar, you were uncool. That was a big relief for me, as I could play neither complex nor difficult parts at the time.
“Taylor Swift is the Beatles of my daughter’s generation.”
Later, when I moved to Nashville, I was all about clean Telecasters and thought ill of music with lots of dirt or effects. Younger me would have plenty of condescending quips about my current love of overdriven humbuckers and delay. Most of my snobbery was driven by my deep insecurities, but part of it was tribalism. The heart wants what it wants; when you find your musical tribe, most of the young zealots trade all others for their one true religion. It might be the only way to get good at something.
On the other hand, my friends and I listen to a variety of music, but the common factor is it usually involves good guitar playing. We love what we love because it speaks to our souls. But most guitar players are drawn to those who are doing what we wish we could do. My uncle Fred used to say, “There’s nothing wrong with being a snob. It just means that you have good taste.”
Between club dates, sessions, and the occasional TV gig, I play with tons of people. I have no say in the set list, so “Sugar, Sugar” moments are unavoidable. I used to feel deep shame playing those types of songs, like it reflects poorly on my personal taste or abilities. In short, I was prejudiced until I saw all of the true pros who could find something beautiful, challenging in the seemingly mundane. It’s like the old actor’s adage: There are no small parts, just small players.
According to Forbes, Taylor Swift was “The Biggest Artist in the World in 2023.” That being the case, her songs inevitably come up on cover gigs. When this happens, some musicians might groan, like it makes them cool to hate on pop culture. But that’s probably because they don't really know her work. Taylor Swift is my 8-year-old daughter’s Alexa go-to, so I know Taylor’s catalog really well. Turns out, it’s amazing, full of truly catchy, engaging, touching songs. Taylor Swift is the Beatles of my daughter’s generation. Snobs will think that statement is heresy, but snobs often don’t know what they are talking about, and they never have as much fun as the people who are dancing violently to “Shake It Off,” or singing with eyes closed to “All Too Well.”The Milwaukee-based “guitarist’s guitarist” doles out decades of midwest wisdom on this episode of Wong Notes.
You might not know Greg Koch, but we’ll bet your favorite guitarist does. In 2012, Fender called the Wisconsin blues-guitar phenom one of the top 10 best unsung guitarists, and in 2020, Guitar World listed Koch among the 15 best guitar teachers. He’s been inducted into the Wisconsin Area Music Industry Hall of Fame. Koch is a bonafide midwest guitar god.
He joins Cory Wong on this round of Wong Notes for this meeting of the Middle-America minds, where the duo open with analysis of music culture in Wisconsin and Minnesota—Koch taught at Saint Paul’s now-shuttered McNally Smith College of Music, which Wong attended. Koch and Wong zero in on the blues roots of most modern music and talk through soloing theories: It can be as easy or as hard as you want it to be, but Koch shares that he likes to “paint himself into a corner,” then get out of it.
Koch and Wong swap notes on the pressures of studio performance versus the live realm, and how to move on from mistakes made onstage in front of audiences. Plus, Koch has created scores of guitar education materials, including for Hal Leonard. Tune in to find out what makes a good guitar course, how to write a guitar book, Koch’s audio tips for crystalline live-stream sessions, and why he still prefers tube amps: “I like to crank that sh*t up!”
John Petrucci, St. Vincent, James Valentine, Steve Lukather, Tosin Abasi, Cory Wong, Jason Richardson, Fluff, and more are donating instruments for contributors, and contributions are being accepted via this LINK.
The L.A. wildfires have been absolutely devastating, consuming more than 16,200 structures, and tens of thousands of people–including many members of the LA music community–have been displaced, as well as 29 persons killed. Historic gear company Ernie Ball has stepped up with a large-scale fundraiser, for MusicCares and the Los Angeles Fire Department Foundation, to assist those impacted by the fire and responders on the front line. The company kicked off the initiative with a $50,000 donation.
“We are absolutely crushed by the devastation Los Angeles has endured over the past few weeks,” CEO Brian Ball said in a statement. “As a California-based company with origins as a small retailer in LA County, seeing the impact of these fires in our community is heartbreaking.
Message from Tim Henson
Tim Henson is donating one of his own Ibanez TOD10N guitars for the cause.
“That’s why we’re partnering with our family of artists to give back in a unique way. In addition to our donation, Ernie Ball artists are stepping up to donate personal guitars and gear—truly one-of-a-kind pieces that money can’t buy. Here’s how you can help: Donate any amount and we will randomly give these items away. Every dollar goes directly toward helping those affected by these devastating fires. If you can’t donate, sharing this message can still make a huge impact,” Ball declared.
The fundraiser will continue until February 14.
Message from Steve Vai
Guest Picker - Ariel Posen
The past year was full of new sounds and discoveries. Ariel Posen and Jeremy Jacobs join the PGteam to highlight what popped out to them over the last 12 months.
Q: What was your biggest guitar discovery of 2024?
Guest Picker - Ariel Posen
A: Twenty-twenty-four was a year of discovery and re-discovery for me. I tend to come back to records and artists that I haven't listened to in a long time and get back into them with a new-found excitement. In regards to guitar discovery, at the end of 2023 I got into Paramore for the first time, specifically their last album, This is Why. I don't really listen to guitar music these days, but I'm always infatuated by the extreme detail of finely crafted guitar parts that help serve the song, and that album is full of that stuff. In terms of rediscovery, I spent a lot of time digging back into early George Harrison, Christopher Cross, and some specific Steely Dan records. Seems to be a theme there. I love all that stuff but haven't really given it time in a while; that changed this past year.
Obsession: Doechii. Watch her Tiny Desk video. She's incredible and the band is too. I get goosebumps every time I watch it, and I watch it once a day.
Reader of the Month - Jeremy Jacobs
A: I was turned on to Mk.Gee after seeing his performance on SNL and immediately fell in love with the vibe. I’m always trying to keep an ear to the ground for new, innovative guitar sounds, and his unique approach to creating guitar tones was really refreshing and inspiring. I love the blend of retro ’80s synth sounds and modern digital guitar production.
Obsession: Jim Lill’s video series on YouTube experimenting with guitar tone. He’s like the Mythbusters of the guitar community and it’s really shaking things up! He’s taking a very scientific deep dive into commonly held beliefs about what makes certain equipment “sound good” and has returned some truly shocking results. I’m thinking about guitar gear in a totally different way thanks to his work.
Managing Editor - Jason Shadrick
A: Big delays and reverbs finally got to me in 2024. Typically, I would favor a modest spring or room setting, but a few gigs this year pushed me into more ambient territory. It’s incredible how the sound of space affects your touch on the instrument. My playing has become more melodic and intentional—but I’m still not digging the shimmer vibe.
Obsession: Noel Johnston’s YouTube videos from his Creative Fundamentals class have been warping my brain. Fair warning: They do require a bit of theoretical knowledge to get the most out of them. However, his triad workouts are a great way to start to visualize different shapes all over the neck—no matter what key.
Assistant Editor - Luke Ottenhof
A: Last year, I discovered germanium. This isn’t strictly true; I’ve used germ pedals in the past, but I never connected with the transistors until I picked up the Death by Audio Germanium Filter. Now, all I want is sweet, gnarly, splatty germanium grossness on whatever I play. The problem is it doesn’t really fit with my band’s sound. I predict many arguments in 2025.
Obsession: Figuring out ways to make, share, and celebrate music outside of the too-powerful platforms that have monopolized our arts and culture. Thankfully, there are loads of people way smarter than me working with each other to build new networks and meanings for music, including some that would be musician-owned. The future is bright—if we want it!